Today's tip is the last (at least for now!) installment of Doc Griffin's Shaft Myth series. We owe Doc and all of you an apology because this episode was to have run six weeks ago. However, for some reason the video file went missing and only resurfaced a few days ago.
In any event, the topic for today is the myth that the faster your club head speed the stiffer your shaft needs to be. This is a very common misconception in the golf world, and unfortunately, all too often this comes to play when you go to a retailer who doesn't know much about properly fitting clubs to the customer's swing. They ask the person what they think their club head speed is and once they have that number they go to a chart to find what flex the manufacturer recommends. Oh, would that it could be so simple!
Doc uses an example of two golfers with the same exact swing speed. One is a rotational swinger who takes the club back to to parallel and the other a vertical swinger who has a 3/4 swing. The player with the shorter swing loads the club with far greater force than his rotational swing counterpart because he has to accelerate the club head much faster than the rotational player does. This impacts the shaft in an entirely different manner and those differences need to be taken into consideration when choosing the correct shaft for each golfer.
As you've heard us both say many times before, having a qualified club fitter work on your clubs may appear to be a slightly more expensive route to take on the surface but if you let someone sell you a club that isn't right for you you'll pay the price in so many other ways.
Keep it vertical!
The Surge
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Comments
Doc,I live in IL north of
Doc,
I live in IL north of Chicago. I would like to go to a qualified fitter but not sure who to go to. Your website does not list any fitters anywhere close to where I live. Suggestions?
Steve
http://www.swingsurgeon.com
http://www.swingsurgeon.com/Da...
Where is 12 oclock? Many
Where is 12 oclock? Many people that I have worked with get the club straight up over their head and think this is 12. It's not. 12 is over the soft part of the shoulder. If you are setting the club over top of your head this is incorrect. The head is only at 12 when standing straight up. When you assume the 30* spine tilt 12 then becomes over the shoulder.
(Sam Snead).P.S. I eat with
(Sam Snead).
P.S. I eat with interlocking. LOL
My website or Surge's site?
My website or Surge's site? All our fitters are listed on this site. Top of page under tab "INSTRUCTION & CLUB FITTING". We have a fitter not far from you.
Just logged on for the first
Just logged on for the first time in a couple of days. Like that putting suggestion Steve. Especially the attitude that Faxon shares. When I get back to serious putting practice I will consider this routine, thanks.
First we need to make sure we
First we need to make sure we are on the same page as to what 12 o'clock is (see Doc's post below for a down the line view).
If you are talking about the shaft from a face on view 1 or 2 o'clock is fine if you can control it and get that far without your arms collapsing or cocking your wrists.
Yes that was Sam. I interlock
Yes that was Sam. I interlock also.
Good Day !
You never know what "Spring"
You never know what "Spring" will bring. One of our biggest snow storms ever here came in April (which is supposed to have pretty nice weather).
Getting noticeably cooler here. Very nice for everything except for my swimming exercises (shut the pool down this week).
Made another comparison video and thought maybe some of ya'll would get something out of some of the mistakes in the swings.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
Always cool to hear a
Always cool to hear a positive success story. Thanks b3:)
In the face on scenario, I
In the face on scenario, I see people stop the club where the shaft is straight up and down as if hitting a knock down shot and think this is 12 as well. If we talk about a face on shot, then the player has to be in the middle of the clock and 12 is right above the head. Of course, the longer the club, the further the club head will be above the head but relatively in the same position on the clock. Good point Steve.
Okay Steve who said this.
Okay Steve who said this.
You can't go into a shop and buy a good game of golf
Good Day !
Looks like your cousin also
Looks like your cousin also sways way off the ball to start.That's just a really awkward and not terribly athletic place to swing from.
I like and identify with Deb
I like and identify with Deb's comment below a lot but here's my thought. I always hit the ball consistently better and often further with a 3/4 swing. That doesn't mean I swing easy, I just have better and more reliable results. I have had my longest drives with a compact 3/4 swing. Reaching for more gives me more..... more trouble and areas of a golf course I really don't want to see. Mentally I still have to remind myself to not over swing. Compact gives me more centered, pure strikes and "I can't believe it went that far". Your on the boat just fine Rex.
Fairways and greens indeed.
And yes, Deb is right, the forward swing is where it's at.
Well, it's getting near the
Well, it's getting near the end of another fun golfing season. I haven't thanked Don and Doc in a while, so thanks again guys so much for your tips and advice. This is my 3rd season with PPGS and I'm still improving. First timers trying this method of playing listen up. It works. I'm on other other side of 60 now and understanding the game a little more all the time thanks to these guys. Fairways and greens, fairways and greens. Surge's advice on his brother's putting grip has giving me more birdies this season than any of the 5 years I've played since retiring. It's just a blast when you have confidence in your putting, which I never had before the 'grip it like you play' tip. If this is you're first visit or you've just got into the PPGS, believe me, it works. It's a journey with ups and downs, but more ups and always fun.
That's the problem. He is not
That's the problem. He is not "terribly athletic". He does have a certain amount of hand skill that lets him shoot some rounds in the 80s but getting past that is tough.
Whereas I grew up playing every sport in the book and then some, he played none. I can do everything wrong and still hit the ball pretty well and he has to make his best swings to have much of a chance for a good shot.
Hard to teach somebody something we just feel. It was much worse before I got him to quit completely straightening his back leg and turning so much.
(He said the guys he plays with said he should straighten his back leg).
Just never even came close to getting him to quit starting the swing from the top.
Good thing golfers are not
Good thing golfers are not shooters.
They would either skip sighting in their rifle altogether or notice while sighting it in that the scope is loose, or out of line, making all of the shots miss, but decide to leave it that way and hope for the best.
(And then be surprised that they can't shoot very well).
Not Steve but it was Sam
Not Steve but it was Sam Snead.
An LPGA Monday playoff is
An LPGA Monday playoff is like a tree falling in the forest with no one around.
Did it really happen at all?
Good Day!
I chose to travel to another
I chose to travel to another state in order to make sure my complete fitting was done and clubs built by a PPGS certified fitter. So that's what you may consider. We made a vacation out of it too. Looks like Michigan was the closest option.
The other suggestion is to use the (long distance) online fitting program offered by Doc.
Not back in Sam's day but
Not back in Sam's day but there are some pretty good ones now.
http://www.easports.com/tiger-...
I'm with Benjie - It's like
I'm with Benjie - It's like Doc's voice is picked up by the mic on the camera instead of the lavalier mic on his shirt. Others - glad it's working for you...but please be nice to Bengie. He's trying to help Doc with quality control, not asking for the world...Thanks
Who wouldn't want to get on
Who wouldn't want to get on the "Champions" Tour?
It's like an extended weekend of golf with the guys...you get to hit from the
ladies' tees and ride a cart while chugging a six pack of beer.
And later, you get to sit around talking at Denny's, while they film you eating
a Grand Slam. All good...
Good Day!
You have a great technical
You have a great technical expertise in your chosen field. I would enjoy listening more to you if only the AUDIO part of you presentations is improved !!!. Wearing the microphone next to your voice might help.
HA!
HA!
Yes starting from the top
Yes starting from the top seldom works out well.
Good Day !
what about chopsticks
what about chopsticks grasshopper? ; - ) DH
Thanks for the responses.Doc
Thanks for the responses.
Doc had it right on what I was talking about. 12 o'clock at the base of the neck. So were I am is slightly laid off if you want to call it that at around 11:00 position from 12:00 at the base of the neck if this makes sense.
Good Day !
I must have really good
I must have really good hearing because I am sitting in my dad's hospital room and he is hard of hearing (I think from Navy guns in WW ll) and has the TV turned up LOUD and when I watched the video on my laptop I had to turn it down to half volume to not interrupt anyone, and still heard it just fine.
Came back from my holiday in
Came back from my holiday in France (played at St Omer) - 5 rounds in 3 days but got slaughtered by my playing partner (rotary swing , strong left hand grip - hits the ball over 260 yards with his rescue and even more with his 3 wood). My PPGS swing was pretty consistent with the irons except started slicing again with 3 wood (and even my 5 wood) as I got tired through the 4th and 5th round. Biggest gap in ability was putting, where my playing partner was lethal from a radius of 12ft (think he made 90% of them ). My putting was dreadful and I even 3 putted a couple of times from 20 inches (yips all over the place). The experiment now continues on my kitchen carpet to find a solution to my poor alignment and inconsistent putting stroke. It looks like weight movement in my putting stroke might be the cause of all the pushes and pulls . Have now put 60-70% of my weight on the rear leg , upper arms close to my body and the ball position virtually central or maybe a little biased to my forward leg. Using my core muscles to move my shoulders,arms and putter as a solid Y unit back and through , it seems to be working . The ball is now consistently being hit slightly to the left rather than some pulled, others pushed , etc . So maybe a little tweaking with ball position might do the trick and I will start getting consistency in my putting stroke (albeit a little left of target being aimed at).
I am a living example of how
I am a living example of how how shaft dynamics/profile do not always fit what seems to be. My driver club head speed is around 98. That would seem to be a player who may best be fit for a regular to stiff shaft and maybe a 10.5 loft. That's what I typically played for several decades. When I was fit last summer my fitter gave me an interesting option that has worked out really cool. 7 different shafts and two shaft inner changable Nickent club heads, 9* and 10.5* The current best fit is the 9*and x stiff DVS Aldila combo. As Doc says there is so many factors about shaft and swing style besides swing speed that indicate a good fit.
It may turn out to be very different from what think it is.
Does and I think that is
Does and I think that is excellent position.
Benjie. Does this mean you
Benjie. Does this mean you have not got quad speakers with super duper stereo, which can hear a sparrow break wind then?
Poor you. After years of gunfire with no ear defenders, I seem to be able to hear it on much reduced volume. Perhaps you should have someone look into your auricles or check out the system you are using. Even as a non-american Doc's voice is clear as a bell.
Then there is always the option- You no likey, no watchee! Problem solved.
Suppose because it is free, you will want it in 3D as well. Now that would be great. ; - ]
DH
LOL
LOL
Yes shafts are tricky. Best
Yes shafts are tricky. Best to be fit by Professional certified fitter.
Good Day !
Still ratschidt wetter hier
Still ratschidt wetter hier im NeueSeeland,snow, hail, rain and more wind. Spring? Someone tell the guy upstairs please.
Managed a short swing session and enjoyed it, even though the wind was bitterly cold. Found a short while ago that my left arm was bending slightly in the BUS. Naughty me : - ( Well seems to be sorted by the simple use of pushing to the rear with my lead or left elbow [right handed hacker]and lifting with the rear one. A lot easier than it seems. Club head through the target area leaving a mark on the range mat and a green stain on the bottom of the club face in line with the middle of the clubface. No discomfort in my previously complaining lead elbow. Now all I need is to get out and enjoy it.
Now to re-calibrate my distances on all clubs ASAP.
On the question of shafts? With many of the so-called fitters around, it would seem that the only thing which is really shafted, is us poor dumbcluck golfers! Thank goodness for real 'gentlemen' of truth like Doc Griffin.
My repaired re-shafted Rescue club appears to be as good or better than it was before I broke it. It was fitted with a 'similar' shaft to the one broken.Happy and raring to go. Thankyou Doc for your invaluable insight to a subject which should be close to all our hearts.
HA ! HA ! That's great.
HA ! HA !
That's great.
Okay My question.
Okay My question.
Has anyone experienced losing power when getting to 12 o'clock in the BUS through the bag ? I generate more power when I only get to 11 o'clock than 12 o'clock am I missing the boat somewhere?
Good Day !
If a lot of people gripped a
If a lot of people gripped a knife and fork the way they do a golf club, they'd starve to death.
Good Night !
New format
Went to the "Edit" page and tried to upload an avatar...Had to crop a picture and that worked.
Haven't seen any way to keep track of new comments if there isn't a feed page. Maybe a feed page will come later, otherwise a question or comment on a less than current video will go unnoticed.
Edit: Search bar issue fixed.
So far every time I have reached the bottom of page one of comments when I click on page two it goes back to page one (without comments) instead of page two.
Avatars. Your image must be
Avatars. Your image must be a square image.
We have some embellishments to work on the comments. But we had to get away from DISQUS for many reasons. We will be publishing RSS feeds for the comments, blogs, and the ability to watch RSS feeds of individual users.
Search isn't very functional right now and we are aware of that. It's on our todo list to work on search. The search bar is in the header at the top under the login/logout buttons.
For these types of questions, its best to email us rather than post a comment. We read all of our email but it's impossible for us to keep up with blog comments.
You can email us at support@swingsurgeon.com with comments and questions about the new site and we'll get to them as soon as we can.
Best to E-Mail
I beg to differ. Here on the site is precisely the place for us to communicate as we learn the ins and outs of the new format.
That way when one of us figures something out everybody else can benefit.
Sharing information is good.
True and I agree about sharing information. But if you need help from us directly please contact us directly cause we can't watch the blogs and the comments. So if you need help and ask within the comments you may never get the help you need. I just want people to be able to get help when they need it. Additionally if we can pin-point certain items I'll write up FAQ pages like I did for browsers. I wrote up an extensive FAQ on how to handle plugins on browsers that you can read here and it is linked from the FAQ page.
New format
What happened to Doc Griffin under certified fitters?
We have to get is information
We have to get is information up. He will be there don't worry.
Doc is back!
Just got his data up here. His data got corrupted when we built out the site and had to get a fresh copy from him today.
garphite or steel shafts for wedges
Which is preferable, steel or graphite shaft wedges? I am 79 and in good shape with an index of about 18. My other clubs are graphite. i hit the driver about 220 yds and a 7 iron about 145 yds. I play only about 20 times a year. Recently i had a swing speed for a sand wedge of about 60 mph; the driver speed is about 80 mph. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Gary Garside