Regardless if you swing with the PPGS or not, it's critical that you have clubs that are designed for you. Clubs need to be based on your own personal body and swing measurements. Because of this, finding the right clubs shouldn't be something you search for at a retail store or a pro shop. Gambling on clubs off the rack is a waste of your time and perhaps more importantly, your money.
Samuel Vasquez sent in a question about club fitting today, so I decided to give my two cents on the topic. Most of you know that I'm big on custom club fitting. That's why I've got certified fitters all over the United States and overseas. It's because I want you all to realize that club fitting isn't something just available for professionals. We can all play with custom fit equipment, and we all should!
Don,
Have you ever measured the angle when you bend over at address? Would it be different for each individual player and would the proper club length and lie make any difference? I think I have the wrong length of clubs and lie angle because I seem to stand tall at address with the clubs I have. I bought them at a pro shop and was fitted for them but I did not use your swing at the time.
It doesn't matter what kind of swing you're using because the clubs should fit you properly at address. Just because we swing vertically, doesn't mean our clubs automatically have to be shorter or more upright. You have to be in the right posture first and foremost. Sam did say that he thinks he stands tall because his clubs are too long. This could be leading to a loss of balance and poor posture. Balance always funtions best at 30 degree angles. Good posture is staying athletically ready like a tennis player awaiting their opponents serve or a baseball player getting ready to field a ground ball.
I actually like the concept of standing tall. But, if you're still having trouble hitting the ball, your clubs might be too long. However, if a golfer is tall, that doesn't necessarily mean they need longer clubs. My son, DJ, is nearly 6 inches taller than me but our arms are the same length. So, why is this comparison important?
Height is not a factor in club fitting. Get that out of your mind. Instead, it's based on your arms and a wrist to floor measurement when you're standing up straight. The key is that it doesn't matter what swing you use, you need properly fitted clubs.
Sam says he got fitted in a pro shop, which is a good start. But, the difference between our fitters and most pro shops is that our sessions typically last 1-2 hours. Sometimes, pro shops will fit you in 5-10 minutes. How can you expect to get the best possible clubs if you were measured so quickly?
The second good part of a fitting is what happens after you get the clubs. Our fitters don't charge you until after you hit the clubs they've built for you and the both of you are seeing the results you desire.
Remember, everyone's body is different. It's all based on your arms and your wrist to floor measurement. If you want to play your best golf, get to a fitter who is going to give you their best effort. Don't get hung up on name brand clubs either. A lot of our fitters use lesser known clubs that are equal to or better than the big name brand clubs. They'll feel like the best custom fit suit you've ever worn.
If you can't get to any of our fitters, they may be able to come to you. So, don't let distance discourage you! Contact us and get the right set of clubs for YOU!
CLICK HERE FOR FULL LIST OF AVAILABLE PPGS FITTERS!
Keep it vertical!
The Surge
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Comments
IMO
Way too many people have the misconception that their body is going to return at impact to the same position it was at address (it's not).
If they are really good the head will stay in the same position.
If they are REALLY good the spine will stay at the same angle.
If they are REALLY REALLY good the shaft angle will return to the same angle.
NOBODY that is any good at all is going to have the shoulders, hips, and knees return to the square address position at impact.
Also the 30 degree spine angle is a rough estimate at best. Put anybody you want in the V1 program and measure the spine angle with different clubs and you'll see very quickly that we have different spine angles for different clubs usually ranging about 4 to 8 degrees for each individual, and that 4 to 8 degree individual variance usually falls somewhere between 31 and 41 degrees for different players.
bifocals
Don, I've heard you mention bifocals in various videos. I have to wear bifocals and am not a candidate for laser corrective surgery. In the past year, however, my optician has fitted me with the bifocal contacts. These actually have the focus set differently from the inside of the contact out in rings rather than up and down in the glasses. They are great for outside activities but I still have to use glasses for computer and intense reading. I can't really tell the difference yet in my set up between the two, but would really like you to do a daily addressing this issue and any self-tests or tips I can use to determine if the contacts are helping. And if you know any pros with this problem and how they approach it. thanks. Tony Lotven
SMH
Added to the list of the things I can't understand:
How in the world a player on the PGA Tour can have putting mechanics as poor as Boo Weekley.
There are a lot of ways to putt a golf ball but his way is certainly NOT one of them.
This is where the game is won or lost
Don't hear much about putter fitting.
Just had a putter re-fit. Stayed with the 2-Ball, but...
1" length was added and a new medium fat/dry grip. Nice.
Our bodies and minds and games do change, and we must recalibrate and adapt. Can I get a witness?
For Boo, likely it's beyond a fitting. Maybe a complete putting game re-build is in order. Maybe not. He's a smart enough guy. Perhaps he accepts his lousy putting game to focus on the rest. It's all quite entertaining....ya never know what's coming next. Giddy-up.
Boo
He's one of my favorite players. Probably because he's just a country boy that likes to hunt and fish as much or more than he likes to play golf.
(A lot like me).
Of course the huge difference is that he's actually good enough at golf to pay for the hunting and fishing (and I have to pay for all three). Ha ha!
I just wish I could run out there and putt for him.
P.S. Ever notice that a high percentage of the time the very best ball strikers can't putt a lick, and the sloppy ball strikers can putt the lights out?
I even see that in our little local games. I can't figure out for sure if it's the cart or the horse that is coming first. A great ball striker like Ron that I play with maybe doesn't feel quite the urgency to make putts, where I absolutely have to be the best putter out there to have any chance...Or we simply were born with those different abilities from the start and don't have much choice.
Wired Differently
Good observation, Steve. We are all wired a bit differently.
It's part of the beauty and intrigue of the game. Of life.
My long game often is not so good, barely adequate really.
(I am in play, but often shortest off the Tee.)
The short game is a work in progress.
(It's my pivot point, and is the facet I really want to master.)
But when putting, often I just see and know where it needs to go.
Fortunately that putting game, like you mentioned, allows one to hang
in the game, score and compete.
Luv watching both types: the well-rounded players that have it all, but also those quirky players with that one facet where they really excel.
putter fitting
It is interesting that many golfers will putt with the toe way up or heel up like Stricker. many may putt with a putter that is not the best length for them and may not be the best head weight (or over all weight) for them. Many putt well regardless. Others putt poorly regardless. My wife is one of the best natural putters I know. I call her A-C Automatic Cindy. I have found improvement after adjusting my lie on my favorite putter a few months ago. Bent it just a bit flatter after noticing a tendency to miss left. That slight adjustment now allows me to get through square and on line with no manipulations. One more thing I found out recently is that my favorite putters head weighs 425 grams while most of my other 5 putters (yes 5) weigh in the 340 gr range. I have read and heard that many pros are now opting for heavier putters and less loft. The reasons are one, greens are faster (certainly true on the PGA tour courses), and it takes less loft to get the ball up and rolling while the heavier feel slows down and stabilizes the putter. Many have only 2-3 degrees of loft rather than the typical 4 degrees. How much forward lean each prefers is a factor too.
Having clubs fit
Many on this site have now had a club fitting. Others have retro-fit their old clubs. The first is ideal and the later is something even most with limited incomes could do if they would only do it, unless for example they have a rare brand of clubs that can't be bent or adjusted.
Back to a fitting. Surge mentioned it can take 3,4 hours or longer. In my case, I spent the best part of two days with my PPGS fitter in San Francisco. We met and actually played 9 holes where he analysed my swing and ask me questions about my golfing goals. Then we met back at his 'lab' to test me on the flight scope, measurements and get some more ideas as to what we might choose for clubs. He then let me take several test clubs to the range and see what seemed right for irons and wedges. It was very cool. Then back to the lab for final decisions. One of the interesting considerations was about the grip. I tried out the Jumbo Max and liked them right away. Another consideration was forged or composite, blade or cavity back. Also gave a lot of consideration to graphite for the irons or not. After deciding on the clubs I was tested on a lie board for lies. In my case the clubs were delivered after being built to specs and then came by UPS to my home in Las Vegas. I was very happy with the results.
Keep in mind that the 9 holes we played on day one was unusual and most fitters are not going to offer that step so don't expect that.
As for a retro-fit, This is basically taking your current clubs possibly considering new shafts to fit your current swing and swing speed. Or at the very least having the lofts and lies checked and adjusted and likely having new grips added. This would be a time that shaft length could be considered too, particularly if you are seeing a PPGS fitter.
For more information on fitting I always recommend golfers go to Doc Griffins web site for further clarification concerning what a true fitting involves. I can say that it is totally worth the cost and effort. Great experience for anyone who truly wants to get the best out of their game.
http://www.thegolfstop.net/index.html
Here was Doc's recent take on club length
https://www.swingsurgeon.com/daily-video-tips/doc-griffin-makes-case-shorter-drivers
Loose club heads
My son is having a problem like Marilyn was having a while back.
His irons have graphite shafts (which he likes and plays VERY well) but lately some of the heads have twisted a little bit. He took them somewhere to be fixed a couple of different times but after a while they always start doing it again.
Last week when we played another friend of ours (that is always trying to sell clubs) talked my son into trying a set he was trying to sell. They had 5.0 rifle shafts in them...So I had serious doubts whether they would work well at all since I use 6.0 rifle shafts and the only time I ever hit a 5.0 I hooked the daylights out of it.
No idea if the lies were close to the same as his other clubs or not but for whatever reason (clubs, lies, shafts?) he hit his irons worse than I have seen him hit the ball in several years.
He is a very good golfer and almost always shoots par or better on any of the courses around here so if everything is not exactly right it probably effects his game more than it would mine.
I don't tell him what to do but I certainly wouldn't buy those clubs if I were him, and would probably try (again) to get his other clubs fixed.
Anybody else had any trouble with club heads not staying in place?
loose shafts
A lot of the graphite shafts torque a lot. If the ball is hit outside the sweet The torque could break down the epoxy quicker than steel shaft on off center hits.
The 5.0 Rifle shafts can flex laterally enough to cause hooks, draws or worse depending on the player. When the vertical flexing is added the graphite shafts can move all over the place. Doc can explain a lot better than I can.
For me to buy clubs depends on the heads. Do they look good and do the weights work with the shafts that work for me. Too often without a good fitter it is a guess.
SGW
Hey buddy, hope your well. I have seen some of your comments on Golf Channel.com concerning the anchored putter recently. That was you right? Seems like I've seen you share other comments there before too. BTW, I agreed with your thoughts and it is funny how you find dummy's on their blog too!
Hope you're hitting 'em well. Speaking of short game wizardry, I have been getting better each week out lately. Mainly due to getting it up and down more often and just chipping and putting better. Chipped two in last week on my way to a 38 playing just nine. Have never shot even par 36 for nine let alone a 72. Remember I was a 18-20 handicapper for many years until finding Surge. Been around a 10 for the last couple of years but now breaking 80 fairly regularly with the occasional 77/78 (so maybe about an 8 now). Barring any physical challenges (ie., my shoulders) I can really see a 36 and a 75 coming soon. Mainly because of the short game. The other reason for better play is getting a better 'grip' on the mental side. Came across an outstanding book recently titled,
"Golf, The Ultimate Mind Game" by Rick Sessinghaus.
Nice to hear from you. hope you stop by more often as i like your inspiring thoughts on golf, especially around the greens.
same person
It is amazing how some topics bring out strident opinions and an unwillingness to listen to others. Guess it is the same with politics.
The hardest thing to realize about scoring lower is to not categorize your game in terms of the average score. Learn to grind out scores when the ball striking isn't generating opportunities. A lot of the scoring mentality starts with being able to putt on the line chosen and with the speed you want. This will let you make most of the putts inside 4'. Then it is up to the short game to give you putts of that length or less.
My personal goal is to hit a short game shot 18" past the hole and to land the ball on a spot from which the ball will eventually roll out like a putt. I also expect to get up and down or better every time. This isn't likely in terms of the odds, but each event is 50-50 and you might as well expect success.
Earlier Steve Smith commented on Boo Weekly's poor putting. A lot of the good ball strikers who were naturals did not have to go through the longer process of grinding out good scores. They also have a longer putt on average once on the greens and learn to expect fewer one putts. It is a lot less likely to to not make a putt when you don't expect to roll it in.
Personally I shy away from total putts and the strokes gained statistics when evaluating the round. Instead I use a plus/minus total. A +1 if you don't one putt a green missed in regulation and -1 if you make a one putt on a green hit. I also ignore the par of the hole on 4's and 5's when reached in two/one. That way you putt less importance on two putt birdies which can limit the focus on making the putt.
Once you can learn the psyche of the grinder you are a lot more likely to shoot good scores even when the long game is out of sorts.
SGW
Really like your line of thinking. I have come to realize more and more that it is the 'psyche' as you say that is paramount. I am understanding my own times of tension and when I am focused and in the flow of the process for each shot and not drifting or dwelling on the past or future. not caught up in anticipation of what may happen or the one I missed on the previous hole. I have bounced back much better as of late after a poor shot, hole or outcome and I see it continuing in the coming months. That grinder attitude of being able to quickly refocus and move on with the next shot. Every drive, every shot at the green, every chip and putt, there are always fresh opportunities.
As Surge says in rule #5, 'so what, do it right!'
Thanks for those thoughts and ideas about scoring and a different way to look at our strokes around the green. I'll look forward to more of your input in the coming days.
Yes fix 'em
Steve, If I were him I would have his old clubs fixed (for now). Don't know what shafts were (are) in his old ones but they likely play stiffer than the 5.0's based on stories you've told us about his game in the past.
As for the graphite, I have not had any bad experiences with heads coming off my graphite irons(or fairways and drivers). They were fitted with the matrix studio graphite shafts by my PPGS fitter. A couple months ago after rebuilding my JPX 800's I bought recently I fit them with the Project Rifile 5.0's. They are currently the right shafts for me. Any how, when I initially re-built them I apparently did not use enough epoxy and first time out a couple of them came loose and my 8 iron head flew off and landed about 50 yards down the fairway! No injuries thank God! So I took all 8 irons apart again and put them back together making sure . Been playing with them now for about three months and real happy with them. That was the third set I have personally built and the first time I had some come loose (and they are metal shafts not graphite). Lessen learned again with trial and error:) I have re-shafted several graphite fairways and drivers over the past year and all are holding up quite well. So just my experience but I think it has to do with the quality of how well they are built regardless of graphite or not.
Now there is one other possibility, and that is that the size of the shaft tip and the hosel of the iron head are just not a snug fit. In that case even if there is plenty of epoxy it will eventually come loose. I have shims in my fitting kit that are made for those situations.
If he was hitting the old set well (as you've told us in the past) than again, I would just have them rebuilt by a qualified fitter. While he is at it he could have them check his lofts and lies and re-grip them too if needed. Why not right.
Fixed
Yeah that's what I think too. I don't hear too many people talk about that problem with the heads getting loose. Looks to me like if they were fixed they should stay fixed.
He would like to get a set of fitted clubs, and as good as he is he should, but he has the idea that his swing needs to get better before he does.
I know what we think about that but...
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